Old Marine Posted August 11, 2020 Share #1 Posted August 11, 2020 I was surfing the net looking for reference photos and I happened across this photo. What kind of camouflage uniform is this guy wearing? Is this an Italian uniform. I couldn't find a caption or location on this photo, but judging by the building in the background it looks like it might be Northern Italy late in the war. Anyway, I thought it was an interesting photo. Dennis Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Proud Kraut Posted August 11, 2020 Share #2 Posted August 11, 2020 Doesn´t look like the reverse of the Wintertarnanzug to me. Could it be one of those (not officialy issued) splinter camo uniforms made of tarpaulins? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Old Marine Posted August 11, 2020 Author Share #3 Posted August 11, 2020 Hi Lars, Thanks, it looked pretty unusual to me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
daskrieg Posted August 12, 2020 Share #4 Posted August 12, 2020 Did you notice the cleats on his boots? Looks like bergboots to me Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Old Marine Posted August 12, 2020 Author Share #5 Posted August 12, 2020 I noticed the boots, does that indicate he is a Mountain Trooper? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rakkasan187 Posted August 12, 2020 Share #6 Posted August 12, 2020 This may not be the same type of camouflage, but I have this photo from a member of the 19th Panzer grenadier division on Sardinia with Italian camo.. Leigh Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
daskrieg Posted August 12, 2020 Share #7 Posted August 12, 2020 28 minutes ago, Old Marine said: I noticed the boots, does that indicate he is a Mountain Trooper? I don't see an edelweiss so im not sure.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Old Marine Posted August 12, 2020 Author Share #8 Posted August 12, 2020 Those are great photos Leigh, the camo does look similar. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
patches Posted August 15, 2020 Share #9 Posted August 15, 2020 It's Italiano, Here's a Color illustration done from this photo in the 1973 Army Uniforms of World War 2 by Andrew Mollo and illustrated by Malcolm MacGregor. lists him as a Grenadier 1945 in the plate description, no unit given with him. With the Mountain Boots he may be from one of those Mountain Divisions, the 5th or the 8th, or one of the Jaeger Divisions, the 42nd or the 114th, or he was in a regular infantry division or in either those panzer grenadiers and just acquired the boots. Admittedly he looks pretty out of the ordinary among this group, not any of them wear camo, so maybe he was the sole man from one of those more "Elite" Divisions. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Old Marine Posted August 16, 2020 Author Share #10 Posted August 16, 2020 Thanks patches. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
patches Posted August 17, 2020 Share #11 Posted August 17, 2020 Yeah the Germans made a fair amount of uniform items from acquired Italian Army Camouflage material, the material used in making their Shelter Haff/Ponchos, caps like the Tropical Caps, like the M1943 Caps, Overalls, Uniforms coats cut just like the standard ones worn, IE M1940 pr M1942, or like or similar to the Panzer Jacket, pants, like seen here on this man, like the Luftwaffa Tropical pants, and then making them in a completely non standard way, as seen with this man in the photo. Some times these Italian Camo uniform items were kept by these troops if their Divisions or even as individuals were transferred out of Italy to the Russian or reopened Western Front, seven cases in point of the former, the 1st SS Panzer Division, 16th SS Panzer Grenadier Division, 16th Panzer Division, 3rd Panzer Grenadier Division, 15th Panzer Grenadier Division, 44th Reichsgrenadier Division Hoch und Deutschmeister, and the Hermann Goering Panzer Division. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rakkasan187 Posted August 18, 2020 Share #12 Posted August 18, 2020 Great additional information patches.. Thank you for adding this Leigh Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gwb123 Posted August 18, 2020 Share #13 Posted August 18, 2020 On 8/14/2020 at 9:21 PM, patches said: It's Italiano, Here's a Color illustration done from this photo in the 1973 Army Uniforms of World War 2 by Andrew Mollo and illustrated by Malcolm MacGregor. lists him as a Grenadier 1945 in the plate description, no unit given with him. With the Mountain Boots he may be from one of those Mountain Divisions, the 5th or the 8th, or one of the Jaeger Divisions, the 42nd or the 114th, or he was in a regular infantry division or in either those panzer grenadiers and just acquired the boots. Admittedly he looks pretty out of the ordinary among this group, not any of them wear camo, so maybe he was the sole man from one of those more "Elite" Divisions. You know Mollo based his illustrations on period photographs. I always enjoyed matching up his illustrations with the original photos. This one looks a lot like the individual in the photo we have presented, right down to how the buttons are open on the jacket. I am thinking we have a match! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
patches Posted November 1, 2020 Share #14 Posted November 1, 2020 Here's some more examples in various cuts, these in Russia in 1944, the unit, the 24th Panzer Division, 24th Panzer Division was destroyed at Stalingrad, reformed in Normandy in April 1943, and shorty sent to Italy in like July 1943, its stationed in the north and does not enter into combat in the south, its sent to Russia mid October 1943 and those who had it took their Italian camouflage stuff with them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
patches Posted October 21, 2021 Share #15 Posted October 21, 2021 A photo of a soldier of an unknown unit and location wearing a tunic cut in the M1935 pattern made in Italian Camouflage Material, the collar as you see is an attached Field Grey Wool one, either scratch made of removed from a wool tunic, he apparently only has the tunic and not pants made from the camouflage material. By the looks of this photo, he may be a POW Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
patches Posted October 21, 2021 Share #16 Posted October 21, 2021 And these well known photos of Kurt Meyer of the 12th SS Panzer Division wearing a full uniform made from this material, the materials to make this were acquired from the 1st SS Panzer Division, when the 1st arrived in Belgium from the Eastern Front, they acquired the material when they were in Northern Italy, they leave to go bsck to the Russian Front in November 1943 and get to Belgium in I think May 1944. the 1st SS Panzer Division, they apparently had a ton of it as not only a lot of troops in the 12th SS Panzer Division wear these items but quite a few members of 1st SS Panzer Division wore items made from this, also members of SS Heavy Tank Battalion 101, all these units were in the I SS Panzer Korps Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
patches Posted October 21, 2021 Share #17 Posted October 21, 2021 Here's Max Wünsche wearing cap and tunic made of it. Wünsche was at this time the commander of the 12th SS Panzer Division's Tank Regiment, he's latter wounded and captured. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
patches Posted October 24, 2021 Share #18 Posted October 24, 2021 At least two SS Panzer Grenadiers of the 12th SS Pz Div with Italian Camo, the MG gunner is wearing overalls made of it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
patches Posted October 24, 2021 Share #19 Posted October 24, 2021 And a MG Team, of the division, the one in the foreground is wearing overalls as well, one source gives his name as Otto Funk, and apparently survives it all getting captured by Americas in Austria in May 45, more like surrendered, his rank here we would guess is an SS Mann, or SS Obergrenadier, or SS Sturmann, not sure of his rank in 45, must of been up there as an NCO. I found it interesting that they, the members of the various units of the I SS Panzer Korps didn't seem to make Helmet Covers out of the material right. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
patches Posted October 24, 2021 Share #20 Posted October 24, 2021 A nicely colorized photo where we see the back of Max Wünsche and his Italian Camo Tunic, Wünsche had received a head wound a little earlier as we see Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
patches Posted October 24, 2021 Share #21 Posted October 24, 2021 The 12th SS Panzer Division doesn't appear to chronicled later in the war like it was in Normandy, so it would be interesting to see if these Italian Camo items seen more use by those who made it out of Normandy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
patches Posted November 12, 2021 Share #22 Posted November 12, 2021 Found another one, this is a member of a Police Unit in Northern Italy on Anti Partisan duty, he wears a jacket lets say of the material, no pants as we see. The Sub Machine Gun, anyone know what type that is? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SARGE Posted November 12, 2021 Share #23 Posted November 12, 2021 I love seeing photos of these field tailor made camo outfits in wear during the war. No factory made official issue camouflage uniforms here. Soldiers are quite resourceful when it comes to utilizing something that works for them like adapted camouflage. While these uniforms would scare me to death laying on a table at a military show, they were clearly produced and worn. Here is a rather neat photo of a group of active duty Policemen engaged in anti-partisan warfare from an album of mine. Notice the Policeman on the right wearing his Heer camouflage shelter quarter over his issue Schupo uniform. Also, notice a couple of these police soldiers have made a have-lock under their headgear covering their neck. Adaptation. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
numbersix Posted November 12, 2021 Share #24 Posted November 12, 2021 I think the machine gun is a Suomi M31, Finnish smg. I thought it may be an Erma or a PPd34/38 going by the barrel shroud vents but the band at the top of the barrel and the placement of the sling attachment fits the Suomi best. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kia kaha Posted November 13, 2021 Share #25 Posted November 13, 2021 “While in Rome” not only the Germans, here are some NewZealand Infantry utilising the Italian camo summer of 44 they have also painted their trousers and webbing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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